Binding U.S. law requires prosecutions for those who authorize torture
*UPDATED BELOW**UPDATED AGAIN below – new video*
If Bush and his people admit that they ok’ed using torture (and they do admit it), and we have a law specifically forbidding it, even under the circumstances Bush et al describe as being the reasons they ok’ed it (and we do)…..and the Obama administration says that the acts used constitute torture (and they have), then they HAVE TO prosecute everyone involved, end of story.
Hmmm…..legal “opinions” eh?
Sorry, “opinions” are not laws, that’s why they are called “opinions”, and laws are called “laws”. A law is….well…a LAW! And everyone has to adhere to it’s standard. And opinions…..well…they are like assholes, everyone has one, and for the most part, nobody else cares about anyone else’s. Unless you happen to be getting waterboarded by the Bush administration, then you probably wish they had a different “opinion”.
Here’s a more detailed and referenced article, but the bottom line is, all the criteria for prosecution is in place, if Obama does NOT prosecute, then he will be breaking the law as well, and will “own” part of the crime as an co-conspirator.
Now I like Obama in general, ( though as I’ve said before, he’s HARDLY a liberal or anything even close to it), but it’s time to get our legal bearings set straght again in this country. And screw “moral”, this is simple unbiased no point of view LAW BREAKING we’re talking about, not some “morality” that’s open to debate or subjective interpretation. This is objective, court-testable “you broke the law, and in this country NO ONE is above the law, for ANY reason“.
Now maybe they wouldn’t be found guilty (!?!?!?!?), but THEY MUST BE TRIED FOR THE CRIMES!
A precedent (if you can call it that) must be set, that no matter who you are, or your justifications, or the political climate at the time, or what’s expedient, or what the other side will do if you do it, the bottom line is that THE PUBLIC has the right to have it’s leaders held to the same standards they themselves must adhere to. And future political leaders and their administrations must know that they WILL be held to account for their actions. You break the law, you get to go to court to have a conversation about it. Maybe (probably) you get off, but the public has the right to see it all, and to make sure the law is equal, and no one is above it. Not even the people who make it.
If you want to keep these people under control, you have to force them, otherwise they will own you every time.
Here’s an excellent bit on this from a constitutional law professor..
Here’s more from the same professor –
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Here’s a UN investigator speaking about the treaty and what we have to do about it.
“We have clear evidence,” he said. “In our report that we sent to the United Nations, we made it clear that former Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld clearly authorized torture methods and he was told at that time by Alberto Mora, the legal council of the Navy, ‘Mr. Secretary, what you are actual ordering here amounts to torture.’ So, there we have the clear evidence that Mr. Rumsfeld knew what he was doing but, nevertheless, he ordered torture.”
Comments
What absolute crap. Never mind the terrorists–prosecute an American administration. Anti-American bastards.
Hi Paul, thanx for stopping by and sharing….
Let’s break down your argument point by point and see where we can agree or at least agree to disagree, which of course is our right as Americans…..not matter how much I dislike something you may say or think, I would fight for your right to say it, and I’m sure you would the same for me, right? Yeh? Cool, thanx!
So ok, to your post then…..
Your first part – “What absolute crap.”
Ok well, that’s an opinion, and although we differ, there’s not much about an opinion to argue, you have your’s…..and I’m….right.
Moving on…..”Never mind the terrorists-prosecute and American administration.”
Well not exactly….
No one’s advocating we “never mind” the terrorists, especially me.
It’s a long throw of the “logic boulder” to say that because I don’t like the idea of torturing people who haven’t even had a trial and who may or may not have done ANYTHING wrong, that means I want to “never mind” the terrorists.
Truth matters, and you do the truth a great disservice by characterizing what I’ve said and posted as that.
Any terrorist who is tried by the evidence get’s the max – period, even if that means “off with his head!”.
Seriously, if you’re proven to have committed a terrorist attack against our country, I will gladly pull the lever. (And those who know me know I’m just the guy for that.)
As to the idea that we should prosecute the administration…..well, only if they BROKE THE LAW.
If they didn’t, then cool, no matter how much I dislike what they’ve done to the country, if they didn’t break any laws, well then all I have is an opinion, just like you….BUT, if they DID break the law, they get to be tried, just like any other common criminal, because no matter what, the law applies to all of us the same, and if it doesn’t, then we don’t live in a democracy any longer.
Would you agree with that? If the law does not apply the same to all of us, then we don’t live in a democracy? If so, then you have no choice to agree with my basic premise, and if not….well then you’re not really an American, you would be something else……”paging Mr. Orwell please”.
And the last bit – “Anti-American Bastards.”
Ouch, that really hurts man……
Ok, it doesn’t…….here’s why – it’s simply Un-American to not stand up for what you think the right thing is in the United States, our country was FOUNDED on that exact idea for picklemilk’s sake!
Here’s Thomas Jefferson – “”Whenever any form of government becomes destructive of these ends [i.e., securing inherent and inalienable rights, with powers derived from the consent of the governed], it is the right of the people to alter or abolish it, and to institute new government, laying its foundation on such principles, and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their safety and happiness.” –Thomas Jefferson: Declaration of Independence, 1776
Most would agree that Jefferson might be a fairly solid American, yet he felt RISING UP against a bad government was not only a good idea, but a RIGHT!
Wow. All we’re asking for here is that the law be adhered to, and the unseen actions of some rogues be brought to light, and judged if needs be.
One other thing, I keep asking where the phrase “Angry Left” is coming from, because I swear, the ANGRIEST people by far that I see in the political arena are people from the Right, and I think Paul’s quote exemplifies this.
He comes screaming in from who knows where, spewing anger and hate and calling names, and yet I’m part of the “Angry Left”?
Well ok, Paul didn’t say that, I’m just pointing something out…
You’re welcome here anytime Paul, I will make sure your posts go online unedited and as promptly as I can.
Sadly, I do get a fair amount of pretty hateful stuff here and in other places, a lot of which has no point other than to insult me, but at least you had a point you wanted to make…..